Transcript

ATP Science

Episode 116 – Intermittent Fasting

Introduction:

In today’s podcast Steve, and I discuss various methods of Fasting, Calorie Restricted Diets and their impact on your Health, Body Fat, Muscle Mass, and whether the benefits outweigh the negatives for you.

 

 

FAQs

 

Stubborn Fat Deposits from Medication – [01:05:44]

Connective Tissue Disorders – [01:11:59]

Best Online Resource to learn about Natural Medicine – [01:14:33

Infrared Saunas – [01:19:11]

Bikini competitors Weight Rebound issues – [01:24:02]

 

 

Disclaimer:

 

**This information is not designed to diagnose, treat, prevent, or cure any condition and is for information purposes only.  Please discuss any information in this podcast with your health care professional before making any changes to your current lifestyle**

 

You’re with your hosts Jeff, and Steve.

Jeff:
How are you Steve?

Steve:
Great.  I’m really good, and it’s quite peaceful in here today for some reason.  I don’t know why.

Jeff:
That’s because the hairy barbarian, Matt Legge, is not here, which is good.

Steve:
Oh yes.

Jeff:
While the cat’s away the mice will play, as they say.

Steve:
And, we will play.  We played last time with the wonderful Podcast we did together, it was great.

Jeff:
The best ever Podcast, “A convenient Lie”.

Steve:
Absolutely.  It was fun.

Jeff:
No mate, it’s a shame that Matt’s not here, but mate, I’m sure we can do the job without him.

Steve:
Oh, we can manage.

Jeff:
So, today we’re going to be talking about Intermittent Fasting, and Fasting in general.  It’s interesting, it’s something that you know is very popular in a lot of religions, very popular in a lot of cultures.  Its roots go back thousands upon thousands of years.  A lot of people use it for Weight Loss, but it has, potentially, other benefits.

I know you’ve done a lot of study, and I, purposely, haven’t and certainly not recently.  I remember watching a documentary, I think it was last year, on the ABC here in Australia, which was talking about a lot of the benefits of Fasting, not for Weight Loss, but talking more about the benefits of repairing broken DNA.

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
There seemed to be some quite good science there.  But again, Steve, I don’t really trust a lot of the information that’s on TV and that’s spoon fed.  This is where I like for you and Matt to go out there and actually do your own research and come back.  But, certainly, Intermittent Fasting is getting a lot of press in the fitness community, at the moment, specifically with regards to improving Weight Loss and improving Insulin Sensitivity, and improving Partitioning, and helping with the uptake of Nutrients when you come off it.

There is Ramadan, obviously for the Muslims is very popular.  For the Jewish culture, I know that Fasting is very important to them.  Christians as well.

[00:03:03]

Steve:
Seventh Day Adventists do it.

Jeff:
A whole heap of religions and people do it.  So, Steve, what can you tell us?  Let’s separate the truth from the fiction and get into it.

Steve:
It’s very interesting.  I found a grey Paper that broke it down to six areas, and there are two main areas, the religion and non-religion Fasting.  Complete Alternate Day Fasting was a popular one where you just ate what you wanted on one day and then ate nothing the next day and just had water, and they considered that a Fast.

Then there was Modified Fasting Regimes, like the Michael Mosely on the ABC, Doctor Michael Mosely with the 5:2 Diet where they eat normal food for five days and then for two non-consecutive days you are restricted to say 1500 Calories or whatever number they came up with.  That’s the modified one.

There’s another Fasting one that’s called Time Restricted Feeding, which is very interesting.  Basically, you can eat between the hours of say 8 till 4pm, it’s usually eight hours a day, and the rest of it nothing.

Jeff:
Right. It’s funny, Terry Crews, who is on Brooklyn 99, and he was in some really good comedies.  He’s a funny guy, he’s in a lot of the Adam Chandler movies.  He’s got a great physique and he’s an older guy, and he reckons he’s in better shape now than he’s ever been in his life.  I don’t think he starts eating until – correct me if I’m wrong – 2 o’clock in the afternoon, and he’ll eat through until 10 o’clock at night.

Steve:
Yeah, the eight-hour thing.

Jeff:
And, he won’t eat anything outside of that, but he reckons it hasn’t dulled his performance in the gym, and as far as his physique is concerned he’s extremely happy, he feels great.  So, some people seem to think that it works for them.

Steve:
Yeah.  Well, that particular Fast is the 16 Hour Fast, and it’s quite a common one.  It was first tested on mice, and you’ve got to remember that mice normally eat at night, that’s what they normally do, they scurry around to keep away from the predators and they eat at night.  So, what they did with rats was they gave some a certain number of Calories – because, you can control rats, and this is the beauty of it, humans go, “I’m a bit hungry, I may as well snack on – so, rats are good to study.  Sometimes animal studies are not as good, but this time you can control them.  So, what they did was they only fed them during the day, gave them the same number of Calories as the rats that ate during their “normal” eating time, which is night.

The rats that had the same number of Calories and ate during the day when they’re not supposed to eat got fat, they got lots of problems.

Jeff:
Wow!

Steve:
That was very interesting.  So, for them, eating at the wrong time of day with the same number of Calories they got fat.  So, ‘If it Fits your Macros’ again, that’s another nail in its coffin, and hopefully we stop talking about that thing.  But, they gave them the same Calories, they just ate at different time of the day.

Now, in humans, you can do that if you’re a shift worker, and for shift workers, like my partner who’s a nurse, it’s very common to, obviously, eat at night and then sleep during the day.  Well, they become very, very sick because they eat at the wrong time of day, because humans are day time creatures, of course.

[00:06:03]

So, there are studies on those, which are called Observational Studies, and there’s not many Interventional Studies because there’s not many people who are willing to stay up all night and eat and then sleep during the day on purpose.  But, it’s very interesting because those studies together say that timing, when you eat, is very important.  And, those, I call it the 16 Hour Fast, like the actor, there is some benefit for that.

Jeff:
Wow!  Obviously, it’s got to do with Hormones in the body and the different processes.  I know when Matt was originally talking to Toni about her issues, which was Chronic Fatigue, and I’ve said this before, he was like a detective going through and asking questions, “Does this happen?” “Is this happening?” and, “Okay, that’s happening to you.  That’s interesting.”  And, what he was looking at was obviously the different processes in the body.  Now, in a standard 24 hour day, and again Steve, I know you’re a big advocate that we should rise when the sun comes up and we should be going to bed not long after the sun goes down.

Steve:
Mm.

Jeff:
Just the natural way.  You couldn’t see, you went around bumping yourself.

Steve:
Exactly.

Jeff:
But, with modern intervention and lights and amazing things like that, that obviously has changed a fair bit.  But, obviously certain processes happen in the body at certain times.  So, therefore, you would say that traditionally when you’re sleeping obviously you’re not eating and the body is geared for that.  So, is that’s what’s having an impact, because the body’s not following it’s natural Fast and Break Fast, and the wrong chemicals are being produced?

Steve:
Absolutely.  There is an interesting graph when things happen in the body.  For example, Cortisol; the Hormone is pumped out at 5am to get you up in the morning and increase your Blood Pressure.

Jeff:
Does that change depending on sunlight, though?  Because up in the Arctic Circle, in places like Norway it can be dark until 10 or 11 o’clock in the morning.  I don’t know the exact, don’t quote me on that, I’m not a geologist, but you know what I mean.  In New Zealand, for example, with daylight saving in Christchurch, where I was from, sometimes it wouldn’t be getting dark until after 9 o’clock at night, and in the summer the sun would be coming up very, very early, and I forget how early it would come up.  Does that have an impact?

Steve:
It does a little bit, but you’ve got to remember, even in those climates people still wake up, they don’t sleep for 16 hours, and that’s because Cortisol gets them up.  So, they still have a Diurnal Cortisol Rhythm but it is changed a bit in those circumstances.  Shift workers have terrible Cortisol dysregulation, and over time it changes.  When I did one month of shift work, and don’t throw stones at me, that’s my lack of – when I worked in the lab it took me about a week or two to get used to working at nights.

Now, I know night shifters who say, “Yeah, it’s fine.  I’m used to it.”  I’ve got a mate I play in a band with, and he’s a night shift worker and he says, “After a day or two I’m fine.”  But, for me it was a long time, but your rhythms can change, and that’s a problem because then you’ve usually got to change it back to the “correct” way of doing it.

[00:09:07]

But, unless you do night shift seven days a week, which some people do if they work in the mines, for example, they do seven days on seven days off, but there’s always that changeover period which is very stressful for the human body.

Jeff:
You mentioned Cortisol there, so what’s the deal with that?

Steve:
Well, Cortisol is supposed to spike up at 5am, and by the way, at 5am, this is an interesting stat, that’s when most people die.

Jeff:
Are you serious?

Steve:
Yeah.  The most common time for people to die is from 5 to 6am.

Jeff:
Why?

Steve:
Because Cortisol comes up, it puts a mild Stress on the body that gets you up, gets you blah, blah, and if you’re 97 not out and you’re very close to death that little Stress in the morning kills you.  So, a lot of people wake up and don’t wake up in the morning.  They go to bed and they feel probably old and decrepit, but then they don’t wake up, and that’s when they most commonly die because of the high Cortisol.

Jeff:
Mm.

Steve:
Or, for 99.9% of people the Cortisol release, the mild Stress is fine, it’s like walking upstairs, which can give people a Heart Attack if they’re on the edge, but for the average person it’s fine, and in fact, good for them.  So, the Stress is very interesting, and I thought you’d like that little state.

Jeff:
I do.  So, with the body then being out of rhythm, if you like, and the wrong Hormones being produced, is there any specifics, and again, you mentioned Cortisol, but what about Insulin, what about the other Enzymes and the other Hormones, what’s going on there?

Steve:
Insulin, actually, is released in stimulation of food.  So, when you eat your release Insulin.  There are other Hormones like Melatonin that is released at night which suppresses your appetite.  So, let’s say you’re a normal 9 to 5 worker, about 8 o’clock at night Melatonin is released which suppresses your appetite – it’s supposed to – and then you’re supposed to fall asleep.  I say supposed to because there’s a lot of Diseases where this doesn’t occur.  So, your appetite is supressed at that time of night, usually late at night, and that’s why a lot of people, if they’re on a plane they sleep, don’t feel like eating, and that’s absolutely normal, that’s due to the Melatonin.  They use Melatonin for Weight Loss in America where you take a supplement of Melatonin about 6 o’clock that stops you eating junk food after dinner, so they use it for that sort of thing.

Cholesterol increases synthesis at about 7pm, so that’s when all your Hormones come out and play.  Interestingly, your highest Testosterone secretion is in the morning about 7 or 8am.  So, these Hormones are there for a reason.  When Insulin and those sorts of things come out is generally during the day and when you’re feeding.  At night you have, in your Muscles Oxidative Metabolism, you have Lipid Catabolism and Leptin secretion, and Leptin suppresses your appetite, and Catabolism is the breakdown of Fats at night.

At night the Pancreas secretes Glucagon, which compares to the Insulin during the day, like a Yin Yang sort of Hormone process.  It’s very interesting how they both change throughout the day.

[00:12:08]

Jeff:
So, in terms of its impact, and again, I appreciate there’s some Hormone things that are not happening here, but the body’s ability to utilise and store the Nutrients is not there because the body is out of whack with its Hormones and it’ chemicals?

Steve:
Yeah.  During the day, you’re saving; in other words, you’re taking the Nutrients, you’re turning them into Fat, you’re making Muscle, and all this sort of thing, and at night you’re spending them to Repair, Recover, and those sorts of things.  So, it’s a spend and save sort of thing, and that’s the way your body is supposed to work.  At night is when you’re doing all the building up from all the food you’ve eaten during throughout the day.

Jeff:
Are there any statistics on shift workers having a higher rate of Obesity?

Steve:
Oh, hugely.  And, Cancer, and all sorts of diseases.  Shift workers are well studied.  There was a big nurses study where they found that nurses become overweight, they get much more Mental Health issues, and much more Breast Cancer, in this particular study I’m thinking of.  So, they get much more of those because they’re suppressing Melatonin.

Jeff:
Wow!

Steve:
They have to stay awake so their Melatonin is not secreted and they get a lot of Mental Health issues.

Jeff:
We’ve probably got some shift workers listening to us at the moment – and we’ve gone a little bit off topic of Intermittent Fasting – but obviously this is a major cause of sickness and illness.  We spoke a lot about if you are a shift worker to get a completely blackened room.

Are there ways to be able to overcome this, Steve, or is it pretty much, it’s a Band Aid on a bigger problem?

Steve:
When you’re a shift worker you’ve got to compromise because the ideal health professional in me is saying, “Go to sleep at 9 or 10 o’clock at night,” and the response is, of course, “I can’t because I’ve got to work in X, Y, or Z job,” so you’ve got to compromise around that.

The best thing you can do for that is to eat as soon as you wake up during the day and exercise then too.  So, exercise Fasted at say four in the morning and then eat a large meal at 6 o’clock, and again, through the night you have one meal and then you have a meal before you go to sleep in the morning, and that’s the way to do it.

With regards to darkness, yes, because any light suppresses Melatonin secretion from the Pineal Gland, so you really need a darkened room and an eye patch, if you can, and turn off all your clocks and all your electrical stuff because that interferes with stuff as well.  So, that’s the best you can hope for because there’s no getting around it, the human body is supposed to be asleep at night, and that’s why 99% of people naturally do sleep at night.

Whenever you go against Nature like that you’ve got to have a good reason, and a job is a good reason, sometimes it’s a necessity, and you just have to get around that because there are consequences of beating the clock, if you know what I mean.

[00:14:53]

Jeff:
Yeah, I do.  Steve, let’s get into some of these different Diets in terms of Fasting and all the rest of it.  Some of the benefits with regards to – well, everything, let’s look at Fat Loss – Steve, you’ve got the research there, where do you want to start?

Steve:
Well, we’ll go through all the different Fasting methods.  The Alternate Day Fasting is a good one where you eat one day and not the next, or eat less the next.  What you find here, in one study that we’re going to talk about, and this is typically across the studies, you get improvements in HDL Cholesterol, that’s the good Cholesterol.  You get reduced Triglycerides, which is good, but you also get higher LDL Cholesterol, which is bad.  But, you get reduced Inflammation, which is good.  So, you get these sorts of things.

Any sort of Fasting increases Fats in your Blood, this is what happens.  It’s because if you’re not eating your body goes, “Oh, starvation.  Mobilise Fast,” and they end up in the Blood.  That’s why LDL goes up, and it’s not necessarily a bad thing.

Jeff:
We did talk about that in the Cholesterol Podcast as well, that LDL generally speaking you don’t want too much of that, but it’s not the devil as much as we thought it was.

Steve:
No, because the Liver makes it.

Jeff:
So, with this Fasting and with people who regularly do it, are there many studies in terms of Cholesterol and the hardening of Arteries studies on people that have done Fasting.  That would be interesting to see if it actually manifests into a Disease?

Steve:
Interestingly, the studies I found were very short lived.  To get the Arteries hardened it takes years and there aren’t many Fasting studies that go for years, and the main reason for that is compliance which we haven’t even talked about.

Jeff:
Of course, yeah.

Steve:
Because, if you imagine you tell someone, and they’re overweight, they over eat, they eat the bad foods, the usual person, and you say, “Listen, for the next day I just want you to have salads and fruits and vegetables and nothing else,” they’ll look at you and throw something at you.  I’ve been in practise and I struggle to get people off their cake after their steak dinner.  So, compliance is another big issue there.

But, let’s put that aside and let’s say you can do that with someone.  There are some other benefits, for example, you can actually reduce Visceral Fat, which is the dangerous Fat, it reduces Leptin, reduces Resistance, reduces Adipose size, reduced Cell Proliferation, so Fasting can be used for Cancer, and that’s what the Ketogenic Diet is good for.  Because, it Fasts your Sugars down, because you’re still eating food, but it Fasts your Sugars down so the Cancers can’t survive.

Jeff:
That’s part of the documentary I was watching on the ABC where they were specifically looking at that, and the theory went that by restricting your Calories and going through Fasted states the body stops, as you say, the Proliferation of Cells.

Steve:
Yes.

Jeff:
Which, for bodybuilders and people looking to build Muscle they’re having small regular meals and they’re almost afraid to go to bed without having their night time shake, because they want to have no period where their body isn’t consuming and liberating Amino Acids to go into the body.

The same thing with Hormones, especially with Steroids and other things like that, and Growth Hormone IGF-1, those things are designed to replicate Cells.

Steve:
Yeah, they are.

[00:18:01]

Jeff:
I’ll come back to that.  But, the idea of having the periods of Fasting was to take all of the replication off the body, and the body effectively goes into almost [00:18:17] [Inaudible] building and then it goes into a baseline state, and then it goes into a negative, and it goes, “You know what, instead of building and making more and more buildings – we’ll say it that way – let’s go and repair some of the buildings that are a bit dilapidated or broken down.”

Steve:
Yeah.  We haven’t talked about the Gut yet, but it repairs the Gut Wall.  You’re absolutely right, it reduces Insulin Like Growth Factor One, IGF-1, which is a very potent Growth Hormone which is bad if you’re got Cancer, good if you want to compete at Olympia.

Jeff:
And, here’s the thing; everything in moderation.  The pendulum always swings —if you’re consistently trying to force that pendulum always to stay right up the top in the Anabolic building phase without allowing it to go into Catabolic phase, effectively, then sure you’re getting all the Cell Proliferation, but what happens if you’ve got Cancer Cells there?  The body won’t have time to seek and destroy those because everything is being built, everything is full on, it’s like taking a construction crew and going, “Right, all we’re going to do is build new buildings, and go as fast as we can, and we’re not going to go back and repair the ones that need it,” like it goes back and repairs the broken DNA and heal it and repair it, which is then fantastic for longevity, which obviously is preventative against many Diseases, and specifically things like Cancer.

And, Terry Crews said as well, and he’s a big guy, if you Google him up, a great actor, a very funny guy, but he’s got a great physique on him for an older guy.  This is this whole sipping your BCAAs through your drinks or taking your night time Protein right before you go to bed, so you’ve got no down time.  I think it’s seriously bad for your long-term health.  Take that into consideration then with any Anabolic Steroids as well, or Growth Hormone, which is going to exacerbate that and you’re putting yourself into a position where you are, I think, going to significantly increase your risk of serious Diseases including Cancer.

Steve:
Absolutely.  We all try and promote this thing called mTOR, Mammalian Target of Rapamycin Complex, the one and the two, particularly the one for bodybuilders.

Jeff:
And, mTOR does what again, Steve, just quickly?

Steve:
It causes Growth and stimulation of your new tissue.  But, let’s say you’re a Cancer sufferer, you don’t want that, I wouldn’t want that if I had Cancer.  But, if you’re heading off to Olympia – it’s in a month, is it?

Jeff:
I am, Steve.  I’m not competing.

Steve:
You’re not competing?  It’s amazing, I thought you were.

Jeff:
No, major surprise.

Steve:
So, it’s horses for courses.  It’s very interesting while Fasting has a beneficial effect on some people’s health, depending on what you want to do, if you want to build Muscle maybe not, but for most people that sort of Fasting, 16 Hour Fasting is good.

[00:21:00]

Personally, what I do to extend my Fasting in the morning is I do my morning exercise.  I got to the gym, go for a run or whatever, and I’m Fasting during that – well, I have AMP V – but, I Fast during that.  So, that gives me that extra Fasting time, and when I do eat I’m hungry and I want to eat.  So, that’s one way to extend the Fast beneficially.

Jeff:
Yeah, I think so.  There are a lot of natural process which I think are very beneficial, and hunger might be one of those.  It would be interesting if there’s much study done on hunger and what it does for the body, including improving Digestion.  There’s all these – you know, the mouth-watering.  You know, in the cartoons with Daffy Duck slobbering over something, or Wiley Coyote.  Those things help with Digestion, they help with all sorts of processes in the body.

I think this constant snacking and grazing, while I appreciate it has a benefit on upregulating the Metabolism – again, because I’ve come away from the bodybuilding scene, and not that I was ever a competitive bodybuilder, but looking at longevity now that I’m into my 40s and having my father who’s passed away, has really made me look at what is a successful lifestyle.

I went out to Josh Lenartowicz, who is the biggest man in Australia at the moment, he’s just won the Tampa Pro and he’s going to the Olympia.

Steve:
How cool is that!

Jeff:
I love it.  I think there are periods where your fitness and sports and goals and all that which might require that, but in the long term I think it’s got to be balanced out.

Steve:
Absolutely.  I think there’s a lot in eating at the right time of day.  We know in humans we’ve found that eating during the day is a good thing.  We also tested the Fasting of Ramadan where you don’t eat during the day, basically.

Jeff:
That’s part of the Islamic religion.

Steve:
Islamic faith, yeah.  They’re really cool to study because they stick to it.

(laughing)

This is the great thing about it, they’ll stick to that plan of eating so you can measure them, and there’s lots of studies done on that.  And, eating during those sorts of things you get reduction to your weight, you get reductions in Triglycerides, which are Fats in the Blood, because you’re only Fasting for say 12 hours.

So, those sorts of Fasts, relatively shorter Fasts, and even night time Fasts, and the rat studies, have shown that they’re absolutely beneficial.

Jeff:
I would like to know, with Weight Loss, I would like to know the breakdown between Fat and Muscle.  Are there any studies that show that, Steve?

Steve:
Yes, they do.  They find that you virtually lose Visceral Fat first.  Now, we better go back to what Visceral Fat is compared to Subcutaneous Fat; Subcutaneous Fat is the stuff under the skin, and you don’t lose that unfortunately.  But, the Metabolically active Fat that sits around your Gut, usually guys with the big bellies, that’s Visceral Fat, that will be burnt during a Fast because that’s highly Metabolically active, it’s constantly circulating throughout the body, and if you don’t eat Sugars during that time there’s nothing else to burn but that Fat that you’ve been feeding yourself.

[00:24:10]

Jeff:
But, the whole idea of these Fasts, especially if you’re looking at it for Weight Loss as opposed to the other health benefits, it’s really to reduce Sugars and other bad foods anyway.  Now, I’ve seen people who do exactly the opposite, and they are lean.  And, I’ve got to look more into this, but they’ll go out and they’ll eat absolute junk because they believe that the Fasted part of it covers a multitude of sins.  But, again, if you were to put in the good foods which are going to feed your Cells and all the rest of it, and you’re not overloading on Sugar, then surely the Subcutaneous Fat would dissipate over time naturally anyway.

Steve:
Absolutely it would.  There were no studies on that because, again, these studies don’t last long because people are people, they get ethics approval to starve for – well, the longest one I found was 60 hours of total Fasting and then breaking the Fast by eating.  But, there are long term studies on people who are on Calorie Restriction Diets, and they show benefit as well.

Jeff:
Linus Pauling – who is the Vitamin C guy?

Steve:
Yeah, Linus Pauling.

Jeff:
It’s funny, I’ve got a memory for these things, but I haven’t read this in years, and it’s like, “Am I quoting the right guy?”  He was a big advocate of Restricted Calorie eating, but every day.  So, he ate relatively small portion sizes, and his theory – and, I think he proved his hypothesis – was that if you restricted Calories by a certain amount you actually had less Cell Replication and that it would lead to better health and longevity.  Now, he himself lived into his 90s, I think.

Steve:
Ninety-two, I think, and he eventually got Cancer, Prostate Cancer I’m thinking.

Jeff:
Too much Vitamin C.

Steve:
Well, he used to take gram doses of Vitamin C.

Jeff:
Which again, I completely disagree with.  Again, that’s the thing, you can’t say one person is right on all things.  But, listen to our Podcast, The Great Vitamin C Hoax, where we spoke about the amount of Vitamin C the body needs, which is only 150mg, especially if it’s from the correct sources, which are found in fruit and therefore you need the Bioflavonoids.  Anyway, we’re getting off topic.

But, in terms of the theory with Restricted Calories and longevity, he was correct, and that’s been proven.

Steve:
It’s been proven in many animals.  There’s not a study in humans yet because humans live too long, but you can do it in mice that live for about three years, and if you restrict their Calories they live longer, about 10 to 20% depending on the species, but you can easily replicate that study.  So, eating less in mammals is good.

I think humans, typically, over eat.

 

Jeff:
I think we do, specifically today in the post-industrial world.  I think with the refrigerator and the store down the road, and the less agrarian society, all those things just mean that food is very, very easily attainable.

[00:27:02]

Then, add in your high Fructose Corn Syrup, the new milling techniques, and the people who are regular listeners to our Podcasts will know we’ve just been talking about these things.  There’s certainly an overabundance of food, and naturally we are wired to seek out Fats and Sugars, and these things are everywhere which are probably the things that – and they’re relatively rare in Nature.

Steve:
Very rare.

Jeff:
For fruits and that sort of stuff, if it was fruit season you’d grab them, but typically those sorts of things weren’t so common, so when you came across them you’d go for them.  Today, because they’re everywhere and they’re flavoursome and they’re tasty and they’re nice –

Steve:
People still go for them every day, unfortunately, and they eat too much and this is what’s killing us.  So, any move away from that is a good thing.

If you hang out in a ED Ward, and that’s not an Erectile Dysfunction Ward, by the way, that’ an Emergency Department Ward, and if you watch the people wheeled in, and take away the accidents and the drug overdoses that happen, most people wheel in because they’ve over eaten, whether it be Diabetes problems, Heart Disease, those sorts of Cancers, over eating the wrong sort of foods, they’re the things that kill you.

So, anything that move us away from that, like the Intermittent Fasting and that, is a step in the right direction.  The big million-dollar question is, what is the best way to do it?  Do we do the Linus Pauling way of just eating less every day?  That’s been the recommendation for the last many, many decades, Calorie counting.  And, because we’re humans and we have choices and, typically, junk food is cheap and easy to get, it hasn’t worked for us because we haven’t been disciplined.

The other alternate thing is to Diet for two days a week, which is the 5:2 Diet, the Doctor Michael Mosely Diet, and it’s all a step in the right direction but is it the best way.  There was a study done that compared all the studies on Intermittent Fasting and Restricting your Calories every day, and it found the overall Metabolic benefits of Fasting regimes are not superior to those of continuous Energy Restriction.

But, continuous Energy Restriction is difficult.  So, maybe two days of Energy Restriction might be alright for some people who can go, “Alright, it’s Saturday, I’m busy –

Jeff:
But, beneficial in what way?  Weight Loss, reduction in Fat Tissue?

Steve:
Yeah.  These were Metabolic benefits, that was Cholesterol and Fat Loss and mainly those sorts of things.

Jeff:
That’s a good study, but I’d still like to know, what about repairing broken DNA?

Steve:
Well, that’s Fasting.  Fasting helps with that.

Jeff:
That’s what I’m interested in for longevity.  Cancer, Steve, you might know these statistics off the top of your head, but what is it, two out of three people will have some form of Cancer?  I forget.

Steve:
Yeah, it’s about 60-something% of people get Cancer in their lifetime.

Jeff:
It may not be fatal, but that’s still a massive increase, and then a third of people are going to get Heart Disease?

Steve:
Yeah, and die of it.  It’s still the biggest killer, Heart Disease.

Jeff:
So, if you’ve got a way to help reduce your risk of getting those – I like the idea of Intermittent Fasting.

[00:30:04]

I like the idea of Restricting Calories as well.  Maybe if you used both in combination, but I guess you would be, you’re eating a relatively modest Diet, you’re watching your refined Sugars, you’re taking out a lot of the Glyphosate.  I think we’re getting an idea here of the optimal way to eat.

It’s funny, because we were talking to Jason who I see from the OP Clinic, this is the guy for my Osteopubis that’s been treating me, he’s unbelievable, but he works on a lot of other different things as well.  Someone came up and asked my advice and she went and spoke to him and he said, “It sounds like the guys are really putting together ideas of how to eat to achieve your goals,” and she said, “Yes, but it’s an 80:20 rule,” and I agree with this.

Steve, you’re very, very disciplined and very structured, and people ask me as well about this, it’s so difficult to eat all organic and eat perfectly all the time.  I certainly don’t, it’s an 80:20 thing for me because otherwise you bind yourself up into a knot and you’ll never be able to enjoy life.

Steve:
And, that’s unhealthy.

Jeff:
Yes, that’s right, because you’re Stressing about it.  However, if you do have an illness or sickness then that’s when I would say you would go 100% down that track.

Steve:
Yeah, absolutely.  You’re 100% correct.  There’s a time and a place for everything, and unfortunately – I say unfortunately, but maybe fortunately – I actually wrote a paper on how Heart Disease saves your life, and it’s the weirdest thing in the world.  But, during my Masters we had to do this thing where we had to talk about a controversial issue based on evidence, blah, blah, blah.  And, basically, what we found was, the most motivated people to eat well and exercise are people who’ve had a Heart Attack.

Jeff:
Oh God, yeah.  It’s like the people who are going into get the best shape of their life are the people who have just had a breakup; one, I’m getting a new partner, and two, I’m going to stick it up you, and it’s funny, I see it all the time.  And, typically with girls, they change their hair colour as well, or get it cut.

But, motivation comes down to what it’s going to take to get you into that spot, so of course, if you’ve got a life-threatening Disease typically people will do whatever it takes to get over it.

Steve:
Yeah.  If you talk to the average healthy person and you say, “I want you to eat more blueberries and broccoli because it will prevent Cancer –

Jeff:
And, organic at that.

Steve:
Yeah.  And, they go, “Nah,” but if they’ve had Cancer or got Cancer they want to know everything about it and how to treat it.  In practice, they were the greatest patients because they’d do anything you’d say and more.  They’d go, “You told me to cut out this, but I also cut out that, because I read on the internet – and this happened every day – because, I found out that this was bad too.”  But, if you had talked to them a few years before that when they were getting the Cancer they would eat anything.  It was a great motivation.

So, with the Intermittent Fasting you do need a bit of motivation for it, because it is tough.

[00:33:03]

But, if you can do it, and if you can eat in your day time waking hours like in that mouse study, and there’s many human studies on that, then that’s a big plus, and you pick the food that’s good for you, of course, you incorporate that.  You maybe exercise before breakfast, do some Fasted Exercise, because when you wake up that’s when you can burn that Fat off that usually ends you up in the ED Department with Heart Disease.  So, if you combine all these things together, and the Michael Mosely 5:2 Diet where two days of the week you restrict your Calories, you might be able to get through to someone and say, “Which days – make it two workdays, say a Monday and a Thursday, and just don’t pack as much food as you’d normally take to work, for example.  Because, on a weekend there’s food in your fridge, you’re usually at home and you’re going to eat more.  So, that’s something to start to try and think about, and you will get benefit from that, and just eat during the day.

Jeff:
There are some aids that you can use to help.  We had to take Josh Lenartowicz off the AMP, and these guys are eating a lot, he’s trying to build Muscle Tissue, it was actually restricting his appetite to the point where it as having an impact on him consuming all his meals.  Which is cool.  Also, the new Gut product that Matt is creating as well, has a significant decrease in hunger when I take that product, which is good and bad; if you’re trying to build Muscle it might put a bit of a handbrake on for you, but as far as Restricting Calories is concerned it just helps, because it helps with satiety, and that’s a big one.

The types of foods that you eat, and again, what is it?  Dead doctors don’t lie.  The Juice Diet and things like that, once you come off those sweet foods that your body craves, and you almost go through a period of Detoxification, your body doesn’t crave them anymore, and then it becomes easier to be the master.  I think a lot of that comes down to the Gut Bacteria as well.

Steve:
Yes, it does.

Jeff:
Again, we’re really starting to understand how these things work holistically.  So, when you go back and you have some of that food and you’re almost like, “You know what, I kind of ate it because I liked the idea of it, but I didn’t actually want it and I only had a little bit.”  That’s great, because once you break the back of it then it’s easier to maintain the new pathway that you’re on.

Steve:
You’re 100% right, because in the olden days we’d say to people, “Instead of having two scoops of ice-cream at night, have one, and it never worked.  Unfortunately, you just have to get off the drug that you’re addicted to.  You can’t ask a Heroin addict to cut back on Heroin.

Jeff:
I love the way that Matt frames it as well, for those of you who are out there stuck in this trap of not being able to rein in your food, replace it will good habits, don’t just deny yourself, “That’s denied, that’s denied, that’s denied,” because then you’re still focusing on the foods that you shouldn’t eat and you’re just craving them.

Here’s some relationship advice from Doctor Doidge, when you break up with someone, don’t pine after them.  That’s what they said, “Get on Tinder.”  No, I’m kidding.

Steve:
We’ll have to edit that out.

[00:36:03]

Jeff:
No, go out with your friends, go spend time with your family.  Focus on things that you can do rather than pining after the thing that you can’t.  Replace it with good foods, go out and get some healthy treats and snacks for you, go and make a fantastic fruit salad with some of the exotic fruits that taste amazing.  Just change bad habits for good ones.  I think Matt’s really smart there because, again, then you’re actually taking that energy and focusing it in a direction that’s good for you.

But, Steve, what about Acamanus?  And, I’m not talking about the football player here.  You and Matt were talking about it just recently, what’s Acamanus?

Steve:
Acamanus is a great Gut bug that has been touted as one of the great Anti-obesity bugs that reside in your Gut.

Jeff:
Why was Matt that up specifically with regards to Intermittent Fasting?

Steve:
He said that because when you Fast it changes your Gut bugs dramatically for the better because you’re not pumping it with loads of Sugar that stimulates the Anaerobic Bacteria, the bad bugs.  So, Acamanus is a great one that if you can get going in Gut actually helps regulate appetite, because there are a lot of Hormones that come from your Gut, and therefore helps regulate the Obesity.  So, it’s a got a great effect on your body.

There was a study on rats – you’re going to love this – they gave them jet lag.

Jeff:
How did they do that?

Steve:
Well, they kept them awake.  They gave them a shift work job, sort of thing.  They kept them awake during the day when they’re supposed to be sleeping and kept them asleep at night, and they got massive Dysbiosis in their Gut, their whole Gut Flora changed.  They took that Gut Flora and put it into a normal germ-free mouse, because you can breed mice without Gut Flora, put it into them, let them sleep whenever the heck they wanted and eat normal food, and they became Obese.

Jeff:
Wow!

Steve:
Isn’t that amazing.

Jeff:
It is.

Steve:
So, just changing the bugs in your Gut, like the Jason Acamanus bug, it can cause Obesity.

Jeff:
The amount of time, Steve, we end up back in the Gut.  We had the Gut Podcast where I think you said, or maybe I said it, that maybe 80% of health problems seem to stem from, or around, the stomach, around the Gut Flora.

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
I’m excited about the product that we’re working on, just simply because I think it’s going to put so many things right for so many people.

So, Fasting and periods of Fasting because you’re not taking Nutrients in you’re not giving the bugs the Nutrients they need, but typically where there’s issues with cravings and Inflammation and things like is because you have an over population of bad bugs.  By doing that starvation and eliminating those foods, you’re naturally going to tackle it, aren’t you?

Steve:
You are naturally going to tackle it.  And also, you could be Genetically predisposed to Fasting in a healthy way.

[00:39:00]

Like, the famous studies that were done on the Pima Indians in America and  Aboriginals in Australia, they respond better to Fasting – and, in fact, the reason they know that is because the Pima Indians when they were put in normal society where they ate three meals a day, almost all of them became Obese, because they had the Gene called the Thrifty Gene, where they’re actually genetically programmed to go through periods where food is scarce and all that, and they’ve adapted to that, they’re cool with that.

Jeff:
Wow!  The Thrifty Gene?

Steve:
it’s called the Thrifty Gene.

Jeff:
Yeah, that’s cool.

Steve:
It’s great because it keeps you from spending so much when you’re out in the bush starving.  I know people who go, “I get hungry after two or three hours, I’m starving. I have to eat every two or three hours,” you hear that all the time, and actually, I’m a bit like that.  But, these people are used to the Fasting, these guys would not eat for days and be fine.

Jeff:
What part of America were they from?

Steve:
The Pima Indians are from North America, usually Arizona.

Jeff:
Is that where they have the Hoodia plant?

Steve:
Oh, I don’t know about that.

Jeff:
I’m pretty sure there’s a cactus.  It will be interesting to find out, but that was something that became very popular as a supplement several years ago, which was designed to help with satiety big time.  It’s a massive market that sort of thing.  It would be interesting, Steve, we should have a look into that.

Steve:
A massive market?  I mean people get their stomachs lap banded because they over eat.

Jeff:
Oh, I’m so glad you mentioned that.  I did want to ask, what then happens with people who are going, “I have got an issue.  I can’t stop over eating.  I’m going to go get lap banded.”  Is there any information you’ve got Steve, and I’m dumping this on you, you might not have any whatsoever, but in terms of what that does to the Gut Flora?  What does it do?

When we were going to do this Podcast, I don’t know, because I haven’t done the studies, I only read a little bit and take a little bit in, but I always look at it from a natural point of view.  It just seems to be a natural – you know, feast and famine, it seems to be very popular in cultures, like the vinaigrettes and some of the other things we used to do, they just naturally seem to come up.  So, I always thought, naturally and intuitively, I think the human race has worked out that it’s good for you.

So, what’s the deal with lap banding?

Steve:
Oh, what’s the deal with it?  I’m dead against it, personally, because I think it’s a terrible idea.  Having a surgery on someone who just can’t control their appetite.  Now, having said all that, the way it works is, they put a band around your stomach because you have these stretch receptors in your stomach, so when your stomach stretches you go, “Oh God, I feel full,” and you stop eating.  Some people get full and then they swig down, guess what, a can of coke, for example, which just fits around it, it’s a liquid which gives you more Calories but doesn’t feed you anything.  So, people eat overly bad and they can’t stop eating and they’ve stretched their stomach and they’ve caused all sorts of damage down there, and Dysbiosis.

[00:41:57]

So, they’ve got this huge hunger they can’t control, and naturally, they don’t gorge on Broccoli and Blueberries, do they, they gorge on junk food.  So, they just over eat and become morbidly Obese.

Jeff:
And, this is the thing.  I have a lot of sympathy, Steve, because maybe a lot of the educational information is not out there, but their Gut Biome is probably populated with bugs craving Sugar and just demanding it, like a cigarette.  You know how people have problems giving up cigarettes, we understand that it’s the chemical process that’s going on, the nicotine and all the rest of it.  With a lot of people, and I’m not giving an excuse here, but the cravings are so bad for food, specifically sweet foods, that effectively they can’t control themselves.

I’m not using that as a cop out because I think whatever your setback you can overcome it, if you’ve got the right tools and the right mindset.

Steve:
It’s very interesting.  They did a study on this in rats.  They identified the chemical in 2002 that causes severe cravings called Neuropeptide Y, and there’s five types but let’s just keep it simple and call it Neuropeptide Y.  What they did with rats was they injected into their Brains the chemical Neuropeptide Y, and they got their rat’s food and they electrified it, and they still ate the food despite getting an electric shock every time they ate it.  So, that’s how powerful this thing is.

Jeff:
Wow!

Steve:
So, let’s talk about a human being, a human being might be morbidly Obese, they can’t see their feet, and yet they come across a cake and they have to eat it, and that’s that chemical called Neuropeptide Y.  It’s scary.  Now, what’s supposed to happen is, you’ve got a wonderful system in your body called Leptin, a Hormone that comes out of your Fat Cells that tells you to stop eating and it reduces Neuropeptide Y, that’s what’s supposed to happen.  But, those Leptin Receptors become resistant when you’ve got high amounts of Fat in your Blood called Triglycerides.  Where do Triglycerides come from?  Eating Sugars and Carbohydrates.  So, if you’re over eating Carbohydrates and Sugars you’ll crave more of it.  But, that stops that negative feedback.

Jeff:
So, that satiety and that increase in Leptin that sounds like the antidote, if you like, for that other compound.

Steve:
It is if your Leptin Receptors are working.  So, if you’re eating a low Carbohydrate Diet your Leptin Receptors work and they regulate your appetite better.  Also, Ketones regulate your appetite.  So, again, if you’re eating junk food all day like Sugars and Breads and Pasta and all these sorts of things you’ll find it very difficult to regulate your appetite because your Triglycerides, that come from the result of eating too many Carbohydrates, stop the Leptin working and drive up Neuropeptide Y.

Neuropeptide Y does two things, it causes intense hunger, and also reduces your Basal Metabolic rate.

Jeff:
Oh, double whammy!

Steve:
A double whammy.  When I used to teach the students, I used to call it the Bear Grills Hormone, because it caused you to be like Bear Grills – that’s when he was famous on TV – and he would eat anything in the wild like worms and grubs and bugs, and his Metabolism would slow down so he wouldn’t starve to death.

[00:45:01]

So, it’s a good survival thing to have, and that’s why it’s there, but it’s bad in Western society because these people say, “I’m too tired to exercise,” and they sit in an office all day and at the end of the day they’re tired for some reason, and it’s like, “What’s going on there?”  But, they can’t control their eating, but also, they might be so hungry that they’ll get junk food on the way home.  Typically, you don’t pick up health food on the way home.

Jeff:
Well, it’s pretty hard to, actually.

Steve:
It is.  I mean you go and stop for a steak and veg somewhere that’s instant because you’re that hungry, so it’s just easier to go through a drive through, and that’s why there are so many junk food places around, it’s incredible.

Jeff:
When I did the Keto Diet, and I know it’s come under a bit of criticism, some people love it, some people hate it, I see it as a good tool depending on who you are and where you’re at.  Again, it’s like anything, for those Pima Indians they’ve got the Thrifty Gene so eating regular meals for them is not going to work.  The guy who’s a personal trainer and got really lean, and goes, “Mate, six meals a day is what’s going to get you shredded.”  For the most part that’s going to work, but for some people it’s not, and this is the thing, it’s about understanding who you are, where you’re at, and what your goals are, and then adapting the way you eat, the way that you train around that.  Also, what you’re prepared to sacrifice as well, whether that be time, and or comfort, and then be happy with the choice you’ve made.

There’s no point in looking at people like Josh Lenartowicz or some girl down the beach who’s unbelievable in a bikini because of the sacrifices that those guys have made to get what they want, which is what they value, good on them.  And, for those people who aren’t there shouldn’t be the, “Hang on, you’re not looking as fabulous as me because you’re too busy eating your cake.”  Well, you know, again, there’s a payoff and a trade-off for everybody, and it comes down to what you’re comfortable with.  But, for most people, they want their cake and they want to eat it too, they want to be skinny and they want their cake.

But, I think this is where the education, the information, the tools, the support, the Diet, the Nutrition, all those things can come together to create a plan for yourself.  But, that’s the biggest thing, you’ve got to create a plan, your goal of what it is that you want to achieve, and then how you’re going to achieve that.  And, whether that’s using the Keto Diet, which I like.  Even Dave Palumbo, who I had the privilege of talking to a couple of years ago, he said, “The Keto Diet is misunderstood – and, this is more for guys who are trying to get lean –  he says, “He doesn’t recommend using it all the time, he says he uses it as a tool.  So, it’s not something that he would do 365 days for the next 80 years, but I used it for a period of about 12 weeks and got great results with it, and I think the theory behind reducing Carbohydrates is a good one, whether you’re Keto or not.

Steve:
Yeah, it’s good.  Most Carbohydrates – we’re not talking about people gorging on Broccoli.

Jeff:
Sorry, I was talking especially refined Sugars.  I think it’s a good thing to remove those out of your Diet even if you are eating standard Carbohydrates.

Steve:
Absolutely.  Because, they’re also addictive, they’ve got that terrible side effect of being addictive, they’ve got other health consequences, and not just Diabetes, but also Sugar in your teeth and all sorts of other problems.

[00:48:06]

And, they’re junk food, there’s no value in them.  They up your Sugar fast and then drop it fast, so you feel crappy afterwards, and a lot of people emotionally feel crappy when they eat junk food, because they just go, “Oh, I’ve just eaten bad food,” and they beat themselves up over it.  Most people know it’s bad for them but they just eat it anyway, and it’s really terrible.

I don’t know how many Obese people I’ve treated over the years, it’s been immense.  I used to think they were all just silly or didn’t know, or, “Don’t you know that cake is bad for you?” or, “Don’t you know that you shouldn’t eat ice-cream as much, or junk food?”  But, it’s a real addiction, it’s real Hormonal stuff.

So, things like Intermittent Fasting, if you can say, “I’m just not going to eat until eight in the morning, or whatever time you want to,” that’s good.  And also, it’s very prescriptive, so for some people they may need that, some people might react badly to it, but for some they might go, “Alright, I can eat till 4 o’clock and at 4 o’clock that’s the last thing I’m eating,” and they don’t have to think about it anymore, there’s just no food, you can drink water but no food.

So, that’s a good idea too, there are some benefits from a physiological point of view, it’s good just to eat during the day.  Ramadan is the opposite where you don’t eat during the day and just eat in the morning and at night, but that still has some benefits.

Some of the negative side effects of not eating enough Calories, and probably the big one, the elephant in the room, is it reduces Thyroid Function.  So, a lot of people don’t feel energetic and they feel sensitive to the cold and all that sort of stuff.  So, that’s one of the side effects, because if you eat less Calories your Thyroid reacts to it.

Jeff:
Could you overcome that, Steve, now with modern science by consuming more Iodine and the Seaweed and Sea Foods and things like that?  And, of course, supplementation with things like T342 which obviously could help as well.

Steve:
Yeah, it does.  The Adaption Herbs ameliorate some of the negative effects.  One of the great things that ameliorates it is exercise.

Jeff:
What’s ameliorate mean, Steve?

Steve:
Get rid of.

Jeff:
You’ve got to remember, mate, I’m not a master of heath science like you.

Steve:
Hey, I’m not very good at English either.  I almost failed English in Year 12, it was a bit scary, I got 52 out of a 100, mainly due to Shakespeare.

Jeff:
Bloody English!

Steve:
Yeah, I was fine in the sciences because I wanted to be a chemist back then, and it was like, “Science, easy,” but English, “Oh Goodness, that’s scary,” so I almost failed that.

But yeah, exercise is a good way to get around that, it boosts your Metabolism up and boosts your Thyroid, and things like T432 are great.  So, if you’re going to Fast or Reduce your Calories, and a lot of people can and do.  You can still feel good if you exercise and take T432 and keep your Thyroid functioning.

Jeff:
Is there a benefit, Steve, from going through a period of Restricted Calories Fast and then having a binge day, as they say?

[00:51:01]

I remember there was a very popular 12 Week Challenge, the original one that I know of, that was called Body for Life by Bill Philips, a very smart guy, it did really, really well.

Steve:
Oh yeah, yeah.

Jeff:
This was probably back in=the ‘90s, I think.

Steve:
Yeah, I remember reading the book.

Jeff:
In the 2000s it became really popular.  The whole idea was small regular meals, six a day, good training mixed between High Intensity, Cardio and Weight training, then there was one day to have off, eat what you want.  And, people got really good results from that.  So, what about that, Steve, is there a reload thing.  Bodybuilders talk about it too after they Restrict and they Diet right down, they use it as an opportunity to build more Muscle and put more weight on and fill back out again.

Steve:
You can.  That’s again, a good thing for a lot of people who need that sort of Restriction, who say, “I’ve got this day where I can eat as much as I want, but just for these six days I’m going to eat well,” so it gives them something to look forward to.  The old plan of just saying, “Just eat less for the rest of your life,” hasn’t worked, so we’ve got to do something different to break that up.

 

Jeff:
One of the things I would recommend, if you are Restricting Calories, especially from Sugars and sweets and that, I would highly recommend going and getting Polyphenol rich fruits, go get some Pomegranate and scoop that out with some Passionfruit and Yoghurt, make some fantastic fruit salad with some Dragon Fruit, and consume that rather than go for the Mars Bars and the ice-cream and stuff like that.

Steve:
I went to a kid’s first birthday the other day, and it was great because they had this big fruit salad bowl there and nothing else that I would eat, because I’m a bit fussy, as you mentioned.  So, I just ate all this fruit salad all day and it was great, nothing else just the fruit salad, and some nuts, and that was it.

Jeff:
Well, during the Keto Diet, and that was what you were saying before, when you’re searching around looking for something to eat and you’re starving, if you’re doing the Keto Diet, and even if you’re not, Macadamia nuts, Brazil nuts, and I like Brazil nuts but most people think that’s a bit weird.  But, Cashews and that sort of stuff are fantastic, the Protein and the food Fats, and they give you that satiety.

Steve, we’re getting a bit off track.

Steve:
Yes.

Jeff:
Anything else with regards to Intermittent Fasting?  We’ve spoken about Restriction, we’ve talked about the 16 Hour Fast, we’ve spoken about the 5:2 which is two days of Fasting and then five days of normal.  Are there any other styles, any other types of Fasting?

Steve:
There was one that I found that was interesting, the Seventh Day Adventist Fast.  What they did was interesting, because they –

Jeff:
For those of you who don’t know who the Seventh Day Adventists are, they’re effectively a Judaic background with the Old Testament, and then Christianity through the New Testament?

Steve:
Something like that.

Jeff:
I think their interpretation is slightly different, they have slightly different observations, but generally it’s that sort of background.

[00:54:02]

Steve:
And, Saturday is their day off.

Jeff:
That’s right, the Sabbath.

Steve:
I used to work with a Seventh Day Adventist and the rest of the office were Christian, so I’d get a lot of over time because he couldn’t work on Saturday and the other guys couldn’t work on the Sundays, so I’d work a lot of weekends back in the olden days.

Jeff:
So, there’s a benefit for being an Atheist?

Steve:
Benefit, absolutely.  Money.  Well, I was still a Christian back then but I still worked Sundays, I was too broke.

Jeff:
I don’t want to get into religious debates, but some people say one day is more holy than another, and the other people consider every day alike.  I think that says that in Romans.

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
This is the thing about being an individual, your beliefs really have to come down to what you believe.  Anyway, let’s not go there.

Steve:
Well, these guys were good, because they often consume the last two daily meals in the afternoon, and I didn’t know this until I came across this paper.  So, I went, “Okay, so they don’t eat at night,” and they so they have a longer Fast.  Let’s say they stop eating at four in the afternoon and then eat at 8 o’clock the next day.  Well, we know the Seventh Day Adventists already live longer, but there’s also other things, they don’t smoke, they do all sorts of other health beneficial things.  But, that was found, that alone, when you take out all the other variables, was also found to improve their lifestyle.  So, again, that longer Fasting period of about 16 hours.

You’ve got to remember, the average person doesn’t do that at all, they’ll do maybe 12 but then again you might eat dinner at 6, 7, 8 at night in Australia, and then you might have a snack at eight at night or nine, and then you wake up in the morning and have breakfast at six or seven, so you only get 10 hours of Fasting.  So, those extra hours are a bit short.  I push it out with the exercise, but it’s something to consider.

Let’s say you can’t do the whole two days off eating, or restrict your Calories, at least try and keep your eating to day time hours.

Jeff:
In all of this information, going back, we’ve got the Diet ideas here, Steve, and again, I am interested in Intermittent Fasting, it’s something I’m going to be doing more of.  I do like the Keto based Diet, and at times I’ll add that in just to remove Sugars out of my Diet completely.  However, I have a big issue with doing it consistently all the time because I think that fruit plays such a massive part with all the Enzymes and Nutrients, and while you shouldn’t be over consuming it, Blueberries and all the Polyphenols that you get, the Resveratrol, these things I think we naturally need in our Diets as well.  So, that’s what concerns me about going on a Ketogenic Diet consistently.

Steve:
Yeah, because there’s only a few fruits you can have on a Ketogenic Diet, like Tomatoes and Avocados.  There’s not many others, maybe some of the berries, the Strawberries, Blueberries, those sorts of things.

Jeff:
You could probably get away with it, and maybe that’s the thing, maybe it needs to be redefined slightly.

[00:57:01]

But, that old saying about ‘An apple a day keeps the doctor away’, apples are fantastic, they are a super fruit.

Steve:
They are.

Jeff:
They’re a super food, really.

Steve:
Remember we talked about cold storage with apples.

Jeff:
Yeah.  Well, that’s all coming together.  So, out of all the Intermittent Fasting, and it comes down to your goal, but most of our listeners are interested in two things, not so much the religious aspects, and we’re certainly not going into that for me or for you, Steve, but in terms of Weight Loss, and in terms of Wellbeing and good health, especially as a preventative from serious Disease.

What would be your advice after reading all these studies?

Steve:
Okay.  The first thing is to just try and keep your eating – say you have 12 hours off eating every 24 hours.  Try that to start with, and that shouldn’t be too difficult.  You have your last meal at six or seven at night, and you eat at six or seven for breakfast, try that to start with.

Jeff:
And, who are you talking to here?  What about the bodybuilders out there?  It’s body first and health later.  Health is still important but for them it’s about the gains, and I respect that, I’m not judgemental.

Steve:
Fat Loss.  For them, the Fasting is a kind of negative thing for Muscle, unfortunately, because you can reduce mTOR if you go on a Fast, and the timing is within 12 hours, and that’s why they eat a ridiculous amount of meals.

Jeff:
But, the pendulum swings too far one way.  Is there a rebound?

Steve:
There is.

Jeff:
This is what I’m trying to get to.  I don’t know the answer here, but this is what I’m theorising, that small amounts of Fasted times, or even pushing them out slightly longer maybe once or twice a week, again creates a sensitivity within the Muscle fibres, because it’s kept off balance.  It’s like if you go into a flower shop – just bear with me, Steve.

Steve:
I do it every day anyway.

Jeff:
These are just theories, mate, not proven.  If you go into a flower shop, you smell the flowers.  But, if you stand there for a couple of hours you can’t smell the flowers anymore.  It’s the same as a hum, you walk in somewhere and you hear this hum, after a period of time you can’t hear it.  The body has a natural way of desensitising itself to constant stimulus.  It’s the same with food, you’re consistently eating all the time.  Is there a way to incorporate Fasting into a bodybuilder or a fitness competitor’s –

Steve:
Absolutely there is.

Jeff:
Okay, tell me.

Steve:
Bodybuilders want two things, they want bigger Muscles and less Fat, let’s assume that.

Jeff:
I think you’re right.

Steve:
So, how about – and I’m just going to make this number up – but, three days a week is when you focus on Fat Loss.  So, that’s when the last meal of your day is five in the afternoon, six, an early dinner, and then in the morning you get up and you do your Cardio and you Fast through till about seven or eight, if you can do that.  Or, maybe your last meal would be at four.

Jeff:
So, 14 hours.

Steve:
And, maybe if you can stretch that out to 16 hours like the studies.  So, you eat at 4 o’clock in the afternoon, nothing all night, nothing in the morning, do your exercise, so you’ve starved your body, and then you’re burning the Fat that’s been mobilised and then you can eat again.

[01:00:07]

So, you have this 16-hour period, because most bodybuilders eat late at night and first thing in the morning, so extend it out that way.

Jeff:
The whole concept of the AMP was designed to upregulate the body’s ability to convert Fats into Fuel, it’s like a primer.  Would you consider that to be okay as part of a Fast?

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
Because, the Calories that you’re getting out of it, what are you getting 2mls –

Steve:
Eighteen.

Jeff:
Matt will use a bit more than that, and he’ll recommend for some guys, especially if they’re big guys, the more muscular girls and guys, to use four and up to six droppers full.  But, you’re still looking at –

Steve:
Fifty-Four Calories.  It’s nothing.  You’ve got to remember the average body burns, especially bodybuilders, 3 or 4000 Calories a day, so that amount is nothing.

Jeff:
Little tricks like that might help, I think, and help a little bit with the satiety, but it should also have a preservative effect on the Muscle because the body is Upregulating the Fat burning.

You know what, Steve, there’s something I’d like to really delve into a bit more; I know a lot of times, especially of late, we’ve been neglecting our Iron brothers and sisters, and again, the general health also appeals to them, but it’s that balance for people to be able to achieve a fantastic physique, Muscle, shredded, but also maintain really good health.  That’s probably what I’m most interested in.

Steve:
Well, that’s part one.  The part two would be – you know how most bodybuilders have a rest day?

Jeff:
Mm.

Steve:
How about for that rest day you just have three groups of foods, fruits, salads and vegetables.  Now, the number of Calories, if you eat a lot of fruit, a lot of salad, a lot of vegetables, is very low still, so it’s like the 5:2 day, it’s like a low Calorie day.

Jeff:
They’ll never do it.

(laughing)

Steve:
Why?

Jeff:
It’s missing the P word.

Steve:
Oh yeah, I know.  I’m purposely missing out the P word.

Jeff:
We’re talking about Protein.

Steve:
Yeah, I know.  Oh geez, maybe little bit, or something like that, just a reduced Calorie day where you have three serves of 150 grams of chicken, and remember this is a low-Calorie day, just to stimulate that Fat Loss and all that sort of thing, just have a little bit of Protein to keep the Muscle on there.  You’re not exercising so you don’t need much more, you just have a little bit to keep it on, and then the other days knock yourself out.  It’s just something to try.

Jeff:
You know, Steve, for them to do it we’d have to prove that it actually increases Muscle, or at least maintains Muscle and significantly decreases body Fat.

Steve:
Well, it will lose body Fat, there’s no question of that, but we don’t want to lose Muscle either.

Jeff:
So, overall Steve, and we’re going to wrap it up now as your thoughts on Intermittent Fasting.  For general health and for Weight Loss it’s a plus.

Steve:
It’s good.  It’s a plus, because of many reasons:  firstly it depends on your focus time of day and the quality of food that you eat.  But, it also gives you guidelines.  The general philosophy of saying, “Eat less everybody and eat more vegetables and fruits and whatever,” hasn’t worked, so we’ve got to try something different and this gives people a bit of regimentation throughout their day and tells them, “No, no, no, today you’re only eating this,” and that’s it.

[01:03:07]

Jeff:
The nice thing is, they’re going to see a difference in their waistline which might keep them doing it for longer, if they do.

Steve:
And, they’ll feel better, less Inflammation, less Joint pain and all this stuff, we know it works.

Jeff:
That’s fantastic.  And, of the different types, and again, the one that Terry Crews does, which I think he does every day, he doesn’t start eating until 2 o’clock in the afternoon and he finishes eating at 10 o’clock at night.  Or, the five days normal eating two days Fast, and for those two days it’s pretty much water, Steve?

Steve:
Well, there are two types where one day you do nothing, and then there’s the Michael Mosely, ABC one, where for two days of the week he just has a very low Calorie, 1500 Calories for the day.  That’s not technically a Fast but that’s what they call it, it’s called the 5:2 Diet, it’s probably one of the more popular ones where they just have two days of low Calorie eating.

Jeff:
I don’t think they’d get the same benefit for the broken DNA repair as what the other ones would.

Steve:
No, especially for the Gut as well.  I like the idea of that 16-hour Fast, if you can manage that, or have a day off eating, you’re not going to die.  You can still drink water, you can survive without food for about three weeks.

Have you ever watched that Naked and Afraid show on the Discovery Channel?

Jeff:
No.  It sounds a bit weird, Steve.  “What are you watching?”

Steve:
Yeah, it’s a bit weird.  It’s actually G Rated.  They just dumped two people in the bush with nothing for 21 days, end of story.  No, they were allowed to take a knife and another thing like a pot, and that’s it, and they’re totally naked.

Jeff:
Wow!

Steve:
It’s called Naked and Afraid – now I’m giving it a plug – but it’s interesting how they go for the 21 days and what they end up eating.  At the start of it they’re going, “I don’t want to eat that, it’s a bit rotten that fruit,” but by the end of it they’re –

Jeff:
They’re scoffing it.

Steve:
Yeah.

(laughing)

It’s classic, it’s good fun.

Jeff:
Oh dear.  Alright, Steve, what we might do then is if you could maybe summarise and put up the different types of Intermittent Fasting and maybe some of the results from the research?

Steve:
Yeah, I’ve got a whole heap of stuff.  It’s very, very intricate, and for some people they might choose this way of Fasting and that way, or not at all.  Because, there are some people who will just eat healthy but a lot of people need the motivation like the Heart Attack – well, maybe not that, but they’ve grown out of their belt or something, whatever.  They’ve broken up with their partner, as you said, that’s a great motivator.  Unfortunately, it is.

Jeff:
It is.  People should try it more often.  No, I’m just kidding, I want to keep people together not tear them apart.

Righto Steve, let’s get into some FAQs.

Steve:
Alright, let’s do it.

Jeff:
First up, this one is from Emily –

[01:05:44]

“Hi Matt and Jeff,” sorry Steve, you obviously weren’t around at this time, but that’s okay.

“What an amazing thing the two of you, and all the people behind the scenes, are doing.”

Thank you for mentioning that, Emily.  I know Steve’s getting some accolades now as well, and Matt and I are out the front.

[01:06:01]

It’s a bit frustrating for some of the team because I guess we’re the rock stars, we rock in and rock out, we don’t do a lot of the heavy lifting, we’re just the ones that –

Steve:
This is my favourite part of the week, it’s really good fun.

Jeff:
Mine too, actually.

“Trying to get as many people as health as possible whilst making it entertaining and easy to understand.  There is so much misinformation out there so it’s really inspiring to know there are people like you.  I just wish I had found you guys sooner.  I have debated writing for a long time and just thought there was no harm in trying.

I have a couple of questions that are not necessarily related but hopefully pretty easy to answer:  The first one is about myself; I am what I think you guys call the everyday athlete, just doing my thing to keep active and healthy.  I’m currently sitting around 10% Body Fat,” that’s pretty good, “and am pretty sure all of it sits on my arms and legs.  Not just my thighs but my entire legs, specifically around the joints.  My Fat on my arms is mostly upper arms but again a lot more around the elbow joint.  My body is so out of proportion, it’s so frustrating.

I have listened to a lot of your Podcasts and I fit with some of what you describe as Estrogen Dominance, Fat deposits in specific areas, but then don’t for others.  Now, I’m no longer on the Contraceptive Pill, my periods are short, usually just lasting a day or two.  I’ve tried SUBCUT without much effect, and I’m currently using ALPHA PRIME and BLOCK E3 but I haven’t been taking them long enough to say either way.

I eat what you guys have suggested, lots of organic Broccoli, Cabbage, Kale.  I’m just wondering if there is something else I can do or could be doing?

I have had severe Chronic Asthma all my life and all of the corresponding Sinus issues and Eczema.  Because of this I have been on a lifetime of medication, at some points incredibly high doses of Steroids.  Through significant changes in my Diet I no longer have any Sinus or Eczema issues and just take Seretide daily to control my Asthma.  Could this be affecting my body shape?  Do I have to resign myself to being out of proportion due to medication?

My next question is for a friend of mine; she has recently been diagnosed with Derma –

Steve:
Dermatomyositis, it’s an Autoimmune Disease of Connective Tissue.

Jeff:
Thank you, Steve.

“Which I understand is a Connective Tissue Disease.  She is slowly regaining strength though is on a lot of medication, one being Methotrexate,” which is a Chemotherapy drug.

I have tried to help her by suggesting she include certain foods in her Diet that are high in Serotonin, Magnesium and add things like Turmeric, Ginger, Boswellia, AFA, Blue Green Algae.  Is there something else I can suggest for her?  Is what I have suggested on the right track or am I way out to lunch?  This makes my issue seem somewhat pathetic when she’s dealing with this.

My final question is regarding online learning; I don’t live in Australia and would love to learn a lot more about Natural Health and Fitness, whether that’s Nutritional or Naturopathy.  Is there a good online course that you are willing to recommend?

Thanks for taking the time to read my questions, and I’m looking forward to developing and learning from you guys.

Cheers, Emily.”

Right.  Let’s go back to the start and help Emily first.

[01:09:03]

Steve:
Sure.

Jeff:
Steve, I’m so glad you’re here because you understand medication better than I think Matt – well, certainly better than me.  So, what’s going on here?  Is it the medication that’s slowing Emily down?

Steve:
Yeah.  Probably the Steroids she was on.  They’re well known to cause huge effects in Fat in bad areas.  One of the side effects of medications, and I’m not saying she’s got it, is moon facing.  Have you heard of that, where people on Corticosteroids get a very rounded fat face, and they’re very puffy around there, and it does put Fat on weird areas of the body.  Because she was on high dose Steroids that’s probably the cause.  Seretide is a Mast Cell stabiliser, so it’s probably not that.  But, I reckon the high dose Steroids would have put Fat in bad areas.  Steroids are Cortisol, or Cortisone.

Jeff:
Yeah, my mum was supposed to be on it for three months but then she was on it for nine years or something ridiculous.  The same thing happened to Matt as well, sometimes the doctors forget to take you off when they put you on and that can cause significant weight gain.

Steve:
Yeah.  It’s only a short-term Anti-inflammatory that saves a lot of people’s lives, but if you’re on it for years it’s not a good idea.  So, unfortunately, that’s possibly the cause.  I’m going to assume she exercises, but she didn’t mention anything about Diet or exercise here.

Jeff:
She said that she eats pretty well as far as organic Broccoli and Cabbage and things, and 10% Body Fat sounds like she’s training, but again, that’s an assumption.

Steve:
I mean Fasted Training is very good too.  So, the products for her that I’d suggest to get rid of that Fat, and the BLOCK E3 is the one she picked up on, which is terrific, and the ALPHA PRIME, but, also the AMP V with some Fasted exercise, that would be ideal to burn that Fat off.

Jeff:
And, PRIME over VENUS?

Steve:
Yeah.  For her I would suggest PRIME over VENUS.  That gives you that more hardened – Matt talks about the dry Muscle, and I love the way he describes that.

Jeff:
Would you recommend T432?

Steve:
Yeah, that would be great to get her Metabolism going, absolutely.

Jeff:
What about removing the side effects of any of the medications that she’s been on past or present, Steve, is there anything you can do to help negate some of the side effects?

Steve:
Well, eventually the Corticosteroid’s side effects, if you work hard enough, will go away, but it’s a tough one because it’s put the Fat there and now you’ve got to get it off, it is really tough, but certainly time should heal that.

Jeff:
Obviously the SUBCUT’s not working to help her to liberate that, which is unfortunate.

Steve:
I think the BLOCK E3 is, because you’ve got to remember, Corticosteroids stuff your Hormones, because it is a Hormone.  Cortisol is normally made from Progesterone in the body, so it really does stuff that whole Pathway up, it’s scary.

Jeff:
Alright, well we’ll send out the BLOCK E, the AMP V, and the T432, and keep going with those and please let us know, Emily, how that goes.  It sounds like you’re on top of your Diet which is the foundation for success.

Steve:
Yes.

Jeff:
Now, for her friend, the poor thing, she’s dealing with some real problems, Steve.  What can you recommend some help there?

[01:11:59]

[01:12:00]

Steve:
Dermatomyositis is an Autoimmune Disease, and that’s why she’s on a drug called Methotrexate, which is a drug that targets rapidly dividing Cells, a Chemotherapy drug.  And, rapidly dividing Cells include Hair Cells, Cancer Cells, and also Immune Cells.  So, it targets the Immune System, it suppresses the Immune System to stop the Autoimmune Disease and that’s why she’s taking that medication.

For her, the Diet you recommended high in Serotonin, Tryptophan foods, I would imagine, and Magnesium are very good.  The Turmeric, Ginger and Boswellia are an fantastic Anti-inflammatory Herbs, and because this is an Inflammatory Disease that’s excellent for her.  So, good on you, you’re really doing well.  Also, cold water Fish is very good as well, that would be excellent for her.

But, with regards to the Connective Tissue Disorder, you can target the Immune System but to get the Connective Tissues strong again you need to take some Collagen supplements.

Jeff:
NOWAY?

Steve:
Exactly.  That’s the one to help her.  And, if we’re feeling generous the CORT RX would be great for the Inflammation, and that’s got Turmeric in it as well.

Jeff:
Yeah, totally.  The other thing I highly recommend as well is getting a cold press juicer.  Don’t get the centrifugal heat ones.  I love it, and Toni is often a bit more organised than me, I come down in the morning and Toni’s juiced up with the cold pressed juicer Ginger and Turmeric and normally we have some cucumber or something like that with it as well, it’s fantastic.  I love it because it burns the back of your throat with the Ginger because it’s quite hot.

There are a few diseases and sicknesses going around at the moment, but I always have that, it’s just so refreshing.  I don’t know what it is about it, it almost makes you feel like your Cells are doing well.  So, if you can, incorporate that as well, and certainly the CORT RX is a fantastic product because it’s got a lot of those ingredients in there already, and also the Turmeric we use is fantastic.  But, if you can, and I know it’s hassle, but try and incorporate some of that fresh juice in every morning as well.

Steve:
Absolutely.  I have Ginger on Salmon, which is a bit weird, pickled Ginger, it just takes the edge off it, and it tastes great.  It gives you that warmth, because, what you’re having is like a cold food but having Turmeric and Ginger, in an Ayurvedic sense warms it up, which is terrific.

Jeff:
I’m almost addicted to Horse Radish, I can’t stop having it, I love it, I smear everything with it.

Steve:
It’s great stuff.

Jeff:
Okay, so NOWAY and CORT RX as well for your friend.

Steve:
Very much so.

Jeff:
Her final question about learning, Steve.

[01:14:33]

Now, Steve happened to be the Head of Health Schools here in Australia, you’ve been a Principle of Online Learning and all the rest of it.  But, can we be candid in that you feel a lot of the times overregulation has reduced the potency of a lot of the latest courses that are out there?

Steve:
Absolutely it has.  It used to be, “My course is better than yours because we also insert ABC.

[01:15:03]

In 2002 the government said, “No, you’re going to teach the same stuff now,” and I understand that, why they did that, but the effect of that was to reduce the course in content and quality.  Unfortunately, in Australia, that’s what’s happened lately.  They’ve also had a change where instead of just doing an Advanced Diploma you have to do what they call a Degree now, so you have to go and do three to four years of full time study and it costs a mozza, and I’m not being nasty about colleges these days, but they charge a heck of a lot of money because to run a Degree with all the bureaucracy involved with that is huge, and it’s 60 or $70,000.

Jeff:
If someone was really interested, Steve, as a Naturopath, or being a current Naturopath wanting to learn more, and I know there are some good young Naturopaths out there because they’re educating themselves and they’re looking for that content.  What would be your top couple of resources?  Do, you have a favourite book, is there a must go to website?  I know we’re looking at producing some information ourselves as well, but that’s not going to help anyone at the moment because it’s not out yet.  But, what are you thinking, Steve?

Steve:
Well, the book I wrote is probably the best one.

(laughs)

Jeff:
There you go.  I didn’t know.

Steve:
That’s alright, it was on Cardiology, it was a few years ago.  But, look the greatest website you can go to is one called PubMed, and start looking up the things that you’re particularly interested in.  Because, if I said to you, “Okay, I want you to learn about Vitamin A, Vitamin B1, B2,” you’ll be bored and you won’t do it.  Go to PubMed and look at the diseases or something that you are particularly interested in like the disease of your friend, and start researching that.  It will talk about Myocytes, and you go, “What’s a Myocyte?” and you look up that, and, “Oh, it’s a Muscle – so, you start to learn and you grow from that.  It’s like putting a seed in the ground and growing a tree.

Jeff:
Again, I’m not a Naturopath, but that’s where I use to go a lot, because it’s a great online resource that’s got a lot of White Paper and published articles, there is peer reviewed stuff on there as well.

Steve:
All of it is.

Jeff:
So, you’ve got a great resource and you can type in anything you’re interested about and then it’s just down the rabbit hole you go.

Steve:
Exactly.

Jeff:
The nice thing is, it’s all referenced and you can then do your further investigation from there.  Are there any other resources, Steve?

Steve:
Yeah, there’s one that I love, it’s really underused, I think.  It’s called Google Images.  Now, if you put in, for example, Homocysteine or something, we were talking about that with the MTHFR Gene, it comes up with the Biochemistry Pathway of Homocysteine, so it gives you a picture of how it works in the body, and it’s very interesting.  I use that quite a lot for putting articles together because you can put a picture of a Pathway in there.

Jeff:
Wow!  So, you’re going to say that Google Keywords is a good thing, Steve?

(laughing)

Don’t you say it!  I will fight you.

Steve:
Absolutely.

Jeff:
So, the Google Images.

Steve:
Yeah, Google Images.  And, the other one, which is a weird one, is YouTube.  That’s a great one that I used to send links to my students.

[01:18:03]

If they couldn’t understand how a Toll-like Receptor works on the Immune System.  It shows you a video of a bug getting eaten or engulfed, a Macrophage eating a Bacterium, it’s amazing stuff.  Really good stuff.

Jeff:
This is the cool thing about the current age in which we live.  Yeah, there’s misinformation and every man and their dog, and hype and all the rest of it is blown up and is to the power of 10 probably in terms of social media and all the rest of it.  But, the powerful thing with Google and with YouTube is that they’re also fantastic sources for good if you know where to start looking.

Steve:
I agree.  When I studied in the ‘90s the way we learnt was a book, that was it.  It was either colour or black and white, that was it.  There was no resource that you could click on in your computer, because we didn’t have computers, and that was the only way you could learn.  So, it was incredibly dry but we had no choice.  Nowadays you’ve got choices galore.

Jeff:
Yeah.  Cool.  Thanks Emily, and I hope that helps and please let us know how you and your friend go, and we’ll be sending her out some NOWAY and some CORT RX.

Steve:
Great.

Jeff:
This one is from Valerie –

[01:19:11]

            “Hi Matt.”  Well Steve, you’re going to have to stand in for this one.

Steve:
Okay.

Jeff:
“I hope you are well.  This is my first time writing to you, so I hope it gets answered.  I’ve recently purchases a residential Infrared Sauna, that includes near, mid and far Infrared so that I can up my Detox, Weight Loss and Multiple Recover Program.

            I’m currently working out doing Weight Lifting and LISS, which is Low Intensity Steady State Cardio three to four times per week, and I’m on a strict and clean Diet.  I’m looking to start doing three to four times per week and I’m on a strict and clean Diet.

I’m looking to start doing three to four sessions of 30 to 45 minutes of Infrared Sauna sessions at home mainly focusing on Weight Loss.  I know as part of the Detoxification process lots of Minerals and Electrolytes are being lost.  To avoid any long-term issues around Potassium, Mineral loss, what supplements do you recommend for me to take and how regularly should I take them?

I want to be able to incorporate an Infrared Sauna into my daily routine without feeling a lack of Energy, Fatigue, or Dehydrated.

Many thanks in advance, Val.”

It’s funny, Toni and moving at the moment, and we’re going to be renting.  One of the houses we went to had an Infrared Sauna and I was so jealous.

Steve:
Nice.

Jeff:
I was like, “Oh man, that’s so cool.”

Steve:
They’re great.  Infrared, for those who don’t know, you might have heard of the terms Infrared and Ultraviolet.  There is a spectrum of radio waves called the Electromagnet Spectrum, and I won’t bore people too much, but there is a bit on it called White Light where us humans can see.  Now, if it’s below the frequency of light it goes past red and goes Infrared, or before red, so that’s where it comes form.  Ultraviolet is another wave length, and we can’t see beyond violet.

So, the Infrared has a lower frequency so it’s quite safe, because high frequency is dangerous, I’ll keep it simple at that.  So, it’s very safe for you and it does help with keeping you warm and circulation and has all the health benefits of that.

[01:21:05]

Vasodilation, it causes a lot of sweating as you correctly point out, and it helps circulation which is what you want.  So, how to stop Potassium loss and Mineral loss, probably as you’re working out a lot a post workout meal could include a Banana which has about a gram of Potassium, which is huge.  But, guess what product I think would be useful for something with an Infrared Sauna?

Jeff:
INFRARED.

Steve:
Genius!  Because, that has the Minerals and everything in it, and the Vasodilatory properties as well, so this would be very good to have with the Sauna.

Jeff:
The nice thing about it, and don’t freak out, it does have Carbohydrates in it but it’s only 120 grams of Carbohydrates.  And, I know we bash, If it Fits your Macros, but if you allow for that in your Calorie count for the day that can certainly help.  But, the benefits are not just the Magnesium, Potassium, and Sodium that’s in there, but you’ve also got Schisandra Berries in there as well, the Creatine Phosphate in there was well, you’ve got a whole host of other Nutrients in there which are fantastic for your body.  In fact, I believe Schisandra is fantastic for helping with Detoxification Pathways as well.

Steve:
Great for Phase 2 Liver Enzymes, so absolutely perfect for that.

Jeff:
So again, Valerie, from food sources and things like that, Nuts and Seeds are probably not a bad source.

Steve:
Very high in Potassium.

Jeff:
Bananas are fantastic, and again, you’ve got to look at the Carbohydrate level.  Is there much difference in Potassium between a green Banana and a really ripe Banana?

Steve:
No, not really.

Jeff:
The greener the Banana the more starch, isn’t it?

Steve:
Less absorbable Carbohydrates.

Jeff:
I know there’s a lot of Gastro going around at the moment, and apparently a very green Banana can actually help to overcome Dysentery and things like that.  So, if you have quite a green Banana there’s actually quite a lot of good benefits to eating a green Banana that won’t blow out your waistline because the Sugar content isn’t too high.

Steve:
Absolutely, and the taste is good, it’s not too sweet.

Jeff:
No, but you’re just annoyed with yourself if you pick one that’s just a little bit too green, and it’s like chalk.  But, if you can get it when it’s just past that, when it’s still quite firm and it’s got that little bite in it – you know what I’m talking about?

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
That’s how I try and eat my Bananas.  Apparently, there are supposed to be benefits of eating extremely ripe Bananas as well, but it has to do with the effects on Cancer Cells, is what I’ve read.

Steve:
Yes.

Jeff:
But, that’s probably a Podcast for another day.

Steve:
Yeah, absolutely.

Jeff:
But anyway, for Weight Loss and for Potassium eat your really nice green Bananas, and again, if you could get organic that would be ideal.  I like the Lady Fingers myself.

Steve:
Yeah.  So, that’s it for Valerie.

Jeff:
Okay, so just get the INFRARED?

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
And, if you’re not going to have the INFRARED get your Nuts and Seeds, and maybe some green Bananas.  Anything else – I’m going to send her the INFRARED anyway.

Steve:
Yeah.

Jeff:
Okay, Steve, let’s get onto the next one.

Steve:
Next one, yeah.

[01:23:58]

Jeff:
This one is from Jamie –

[01:24:02]

“Hi guys.  I’ve been using your products for a while and am a dedicated Podcast listener.  I really, really appreciate the information you provide on your Podcasts and I have recommended several of my friends to listen to it as it’s so educational.

I’m having some trouble at the moment figuring out what’s going on with my body.  Without writing a novel, I’ll quickly note my situation.  Sorry in advance.

I’ve been training for three years.  For the first two years I was on a 1500 Calorie Diet of high Protein low Carb and little to no Fat, and doing one hour of Cardio Plus a day, and Resistance Training.  I competed in a bikini comp in September 2015 and was 8% Body Fat at 44 kilos and 162 centimetres tall.

Since competing I have been training at F45 and am also still doing some Resistance Training.  I switched to a Vegetarian Diet about eight months ago, and about six months ago I went completely Vegan.  I have been putting on weight every week, and have put on about 9 kilos in the last three months and cannot figure out why, is it stubborn Fat around my hips and my lower abdomen.  There’s just this big blob of Fat at the back of my thighs and my Triceps area, which I have never had in my life.

I did take a product by another company for a while, which I think had a lot of Testosterone in it, but I stopped taking it about two months ago.  So, from my research and listening to your Podcasts I have a feeling it may either be an issue with my Leptin or Estrogen.  I get Blood tests done every six to eight weeks to ensure that all my levels are correct, due to my Vegan Diet.  The only supplement I’m taking at the moment is Methyl B12, and your L-Glutamine.  I was also taking AMP V until about a week ago as I’ve tried to reduce my stimulants and my Diet.

The doctor did think that I might have PCOS, so I had a Cervical ultrasound but they said my Ovaries look fine, but I still fit PCOS perfectly.  So, in ending, and I’m sorry about the length of my email, I’m not sure which product I will benefit most from, T432, ALPHA VENUS or MARS?

I hope you might be able to point me in the right direction.  Keep the Podcasts coming.

Your most loyal fan, Jamie.”

It’s a good question.

Steve:
Yeah, it’s a good question.

Jeff:
Can I just clear up a couple of things really quickly?  Your AMP is not a stimulant in terms of the fact that it’s going to impact on your Adrenal function.  The stimulation effect that you get from it is purely through it crossing the Blood Brain Barrier.  Steve, anything else to add?

Steve:
Yeah.  She said, “I was also taking AMP V until about a week ago as I have tried to reduce my stimulants,” so maybe she’s taking AMP V to try and reduce her stimulants, so maybe she was on a simulant and now she’s not, I don’t know.  I’m just reading it differently.

Jeff:
“I was also taking AMP V until about a week ago as I have tried to reduce any stimulants in my Diet.”

Steve:
Okay.  It’s not a stimulant, it doesn’t stimulate anything, it just stimulates Fat Burning, which gives you more Energy, because you’ve got more fuel at access, but it’s not a stimulant like Caffeine.

Jeff:
But, some people seem to be more susceptible to it than others, they go, “My gosh, what is in this thing, this is crazy,” so it just seems to be hitting those Receptors in the Brain.  So, that’s not a bad thing, and certainly is not a stimulant in terms that it will not have any negative effect on your Cortisol levels or on your Adrenal Cortex or anything like that.

[01:27:04]

Steve:
Exactly.  And, she mentioned she’s on a Vegan Diet and she’s put on an extraordinary amount of weight, for her, nine kilos from 44 is huge in three months, that’s almost a kilo a week, it’s incredible.

Jeff:
Again, Steve, I’m going to throw something out there, and I know you’ve probably got some good answers here, but I immediately think, “I wonder if her Soy has increased,” that’s one I always think of.  But, anyway, what are you thinking?

Steve:
Well, the Soy, but a Vegan Diet could be hot chips.  You know what I mean?

Jeff:
Right.  I don’t think so.  By the sounds of her she sounds pretty switched on, being a competitor as well.  I mean this 1500 Calorie Diet with extremely low Fat that’s a real concern, that can certainly lead to all sort of Hormonal issues and Metabolic damage which you may have inadvertently stumbled upon.

Steve:
Yeah.  I think she’s having a lot of Soy, that’s what I’m guessing, and that’s stuffing up her Thyroid and Estrogen balance, so therefore she’s getting those deposits of Fat that are Estrogen Dominant pods of Fat.  But, PCOS you could have PCOS without the Cysts on the Ovaries.  So, this could be a big problem, and I think you’re right, it could be the higher Carbohydrates causing the Insulin and causing the Testosterone making the Estrogen Dominance, that could be one thing.

So, I think for her, the T432 would be absolutely ideal for her and probably the VENUS not the PRIME.

Jeff:
Now, what I would suggest as well, as far as Protein is concerned in your Diet, natural sources for a Vegan, Steve, what would be your pick?

Steve:
Oh, you’re asking something difficult because there’s no super-duper quality ones, but Pea Protein and probably Rice Protein are the best ones.

Jeff:
I hate Pea Protein, and I know what you’re saying, because of the pick they’re probably the better ones, but because of the Amylase and that, that it has, especially for girls as well, it can have a real impact on Thrush and things like that.

Matt and I were talking about it a while ago, and we’ve mentioned it in our Seminars, that if you are Vegan, our belief is, the choice of Protein to go for is more of a Rice Protein.  I think generally it’s better.  The other one is Hemp, I know Matt’s a fan of Hemp, but I don’t know how easy it is to get here in Australia, but those would be a couple of suggestions.

Definitely have a look at the Soy if you are consuming Soy, and that’s in the way of Tofu and that as well.  Try and restrict getting too much, but a little bit is probably not too bad, especially if it’s fermented it’s not too bad.

Steve:
It’s actually okay fermented.

Jeff:
But, if you’re consuming a Soy Protein or a Soy Isolate Protein get off that immediately.

Steve:
Yeah, absolutely.  It’s a train wreck.  Also, with this, it’s very interesting because my first question, when I used to talk to Vegans about this, was, “Why are you Vegan?” and a lot of people would say, “It’s a good way to lose weight,” but it’s not for her.

[01:30:04]

Jeff:
No.

Steve:
She could have a very good reason for being a Vegan like hates killing animals or whatever, and then you back off.

Jeff:
I totally understand that.

Steve:
But, if the reason for you is to improve your health, putting on 9 kilos in three months is obviously going the wrong way.

Jeff:
I really appreciate people, whatever faith they have, be it Christian, or Muslim, or whatever, and our Vegan friends as well, I like to tease them by doing the Spock sign and saying, “May the Force be with you,” which is insulting Trekkies and Star Wars fans, and Vegans all in one go.  But, what I mean by that is, I appreciate they’re a very fervent passionate group of people, sometimes, at heart.  And, for people who are doing it because of animal reasons I totally respect that, and that’s not going to change if it’s Emily.

If it’s for health reasons I always like cold water fish, I do like Salmon and organic fish, I love that in the Diet because it’s such a great source of Omegas, there are some really good things in there.

Steve:
Antioxidants.

Jeff:
Yeah, and for Iron as well, a little bit of red meat from time to time, but if you’re a Vegan then you’ve just got to find other sources, probably – what’s the best source of Iron?

Steve:
Red meat.

Jeff:
No, outside of red meat.

Steve:
Yeah, Collard greens mixed with Protein, like Fish.

Jeff:
But, if you’re not eating Fish, Steve?

Steve:
Oh.

Jeff:
You’ve just got to be careful, even some of the Iron supplements can make you constipated.  But, if you are going to get an Iron supplement what are you looking for?

Steve:
An Iron Chelate.

Jeff:
I like to say Chelate – I don’t know, I just read it.  But, you want the 3 not the 2plus.

Steve:
Yeah, which is Chelated form.  You don’t want the Iron Sulphate, that’s really bad.

Jeff:
Yeah, it will make you constipated in a hurry.  Oxidative Stress everywhere.

But, we’ll send out the T432 and the AMP V.  Let us know how you get on, and if you can incorporate other things outside of the Vegan Diet, because you’re doing it for a health choice as opposed to belief system as far as animals, that could help.  And, again, I’m not saying that you can’t achieve good results on a Vegan Diet, in fact a lot of people out there say, “I’m getting the best results since turning Vegan.”

Steve:
And, maybe Collagen, and I know it’s from an animal, but it’s more of a question mark with that one.

Jeff:
I love it.  Somebody asked a question the other day, “I can’t believe you guys are selling a Collagen based Protein.  It’s the worst type of Protein.”

Steve:
Why?  It’s the best type.

Jeff:
Well, because they didn’t understand – I think it might have been from a humane point of view, but also from a Macro Nutrient point of view where they just look at the Amino profile, and yeah, Collagen isn’t great when you look at the Amino Acid profile, but that’s not the selling benefit, especially with the NOWAY which has the Bioactive Peptide.

[01:33:02]

Again, people who are Vegan, you cannot use NOWAY because it comes from animal sources.

Steve, that’s all we’ve got time for today.

Steve:
Okay.

Jeff:
But, thanks Jamie, please let us know how you get on.  And, thanks Steve.

Steve:
No worries.

Jeff:
That was an interesting Podcast.  You’re going to put up the notes.

Steve:
Absolutely.

Jeff:
Guys, we’ll be back next week and hopefully Matt will be back, or maybe hopefully not.

Steve:
Oh, hopefully not.  No, no.

Jeff:
If you enjoyed the Podcast without him please hit the light button and we’ll stick it up him.

(laughing)

Alright, thanks guys.

Steve:
Thank you.  Have a great day.

 

END OF TRANSCRIPT

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